First Catholic VP is elected
The day shouldn’t pass without the headline above appearing somewhere – I suspect it will be a dotCommonweal exclusive. Joe Biden was the forgotten “first” in a campaign that featured candidates who all were potential “firsts,” be it for race, gender, age or, in the Delaware senator’s case, religion.
Of course, John F. Kennedy blazed the trail for Catholics. But it has taken nearly 50 years for another Catholic to follow him to victory on a national ticket. This time, the issue was not whether the candidate would adhere too closely to the dictates of the Catholic hierarchy. More like the opposite: Biden had to weather some serious criticism from bishops about his views on abortion (and his bad theology on the subject).
Biden’s home town, Scranton, Pa., became a national emblem of the fight for Catholic votes. Scranton’s bishop, Joseph Martino, said he would deny the Eucharist to Biden and took many other steps to condemn not only the Obama-Biden ticket but Catholics who supported it. Lackawanna County went to the Democratic ticket, 62 percent to 36 percent – the bishop’s effort to sway voters failed. In Lackawanna County, as in the nation, a majority of Catholics supported the Obama-Biden ticket.
“Whispers in the Loggia” reminded me, too! Otherwise, you’re right, this “first” was buried by the others. I’m hoping this victory, especially in places like Scranton, will help us move past the identity politics and the “Catholic vote” stuff — obviously the majority of lay Catholics know it’s not as simple as that, whatever their bishop tells them.
Where’s Norman Vincent Peale when you need him?
Just kidding. Congrats to all the Obama supporters here who must be elated.
As some of you may know Scranton has been the scene of a battle between Catholic teachers and Bishop Martino. Martino reorganized the schools and in the process unilaterally disbarred the teacher union. They recently won a case for severance pay but the do not fall under the Pennsylvania labor laws. There was a bill before the state legislature to change that.
Martino is in violation of all that the Vatican has expressed about the rights of workers to unionize. Is it any wonder Catholics no longer listen to him.
“Martino is in violation of all that the Vatican has expressed about the rights of workers to unionize.”
With all due respect (and tongue in cheek), I must disagree: The right to organize does not apply to church employees. They do, after all, work in the vinyards of the Lord, and Jesus said nothing about the right to organize :) Ecclesial employees should be prepared to work for paltry wages so that the rest of us can afford to continue sending our kids to Catholic schools!
Seriously, bishops like Martino will continue to lose influence among the Catholic laity at large. These guys are, indeed, their own worst enemies.
(And to think they truly believe they are doing the Lord’s work while the rest of us are going to hell in a handbasket. Unbelievable — but, sadly, true!)
Their belief, that is, not our destination :)
Paul, thanks, it is worthy of noting. Kind of hard to believe in retrospect that it ever would have mattered to large sectors of the country.
With God, all things are possible. In the Spirit of the year of St.Paul, my prayer is for the conversion of hearts, that all may come to understand that every Human Life is a Gift from God, who has, from the beginning, created a Father and a Mother, as a perfect complement, in the Loving relationship of Family.
Therre is so much to speculate about in Joe Biden’s affirmation by the people of Scranton and state given the denunciations from Carfdinal Geoge through Bp. Martino and so many other pontificating prelates. The role of Senator Casey will be interesting to know. Biden must be praised for making All Saint’s Day Mass even though he and his mother perhaps didn’t re damnation for those of alize that it was not binding falling on Satgurday! He should get some kudos for that effort! But the ticket owes the bishops nothing… only their goodwill and commonsense and truly shared values will motivate them to approach the bishops who gneral demeanor must be prettty sour this morning. I would love to be a fly on the wall in their informal discussions next wek. Will any of them chastise another for at best intemperate and at worst nearly illegal (according to IRS) endorsements. Plus all the threats of us voting for Obama! MAybe some indulgences will help us!
The fact that Scranton and Lackawanna County went blue doesn’t surprise me — people with deep roots there are very comfortable reconciling prolife principles and Democratic politics. Bishop Martino wasn’t going to change that, for all his shouting, particularly since he hasn’t done much to establish credibility in other matters, as John Borst notes. (But Joseph J. is correct, at least as far as the Vatican is concerned — Rome recently denied the teachers’ appeal and upheld Martino’s ruling against unionization.)
On the other hand, parts of the diocese were decisively red, including Wayne County, the site of that parish discussion Martino ambushed. But I think that, too, has more to do with longtime political affiliations than it does with the bishop’s recent antics. That’s a very rural area; they cling to their guns, as it were.
My prayer is that all Americans, who profess to be Catholic, have the Courage to be Catholic Americans.
Which I suppose would be the same thing as saying, cling to your Catholic Faith, and never let go. The Truth is a powerful weapon!
Mr. Pasinski: You spoke somewhat indiscriminatelyabout “the bishops.” Let’s keep in mind that it was a distinct minority of bishops who engaged in the apocalyptic warnings and threats. Most of the bishops knew better.
Have been tempted (no time) to put together a spreadsheet listing the most outspoken single issue bishops; where they were trained; what has been their stance on sexual abuse; are they members of Opus Dei, Legionnaires, Tridentine by choice, etc.; are they facing specific diocesan challenges such as parish consolidations; unions in hospitals/schools; financial irregularities; priest morale issues; etc.
Initial efforts do indicate a pattern – the most outspoken are also the most legalistic, delaying, and obstructionist in dealing with sexual abuse; some face difficulties with parish financial issues; some face consolidations; some are Opus Dei or Tridentine leaning….just interesting.
Agree with Fr. K’s comments but with a caution – depending upon how you interpret Rocco Palmo’s count of bishops who spoke or wrote out, he shows 90+ out of a total of 270 bishops. Guess you could call that a “distinct minority” – guess we will find out next week.
BTW – here are some comments about George’s note to Obama as head of the USCCB and then some biographical comments about Bishop Finn who said a vote for Obama would get you hell from a trusted friend:
“Speaking of George, I thought it interesting that he sent the de rigeur congratulations note to Obama today on behalf of the USCCB and, of course, he got in a not too subtle reference to abortion. B-16, on the other hand, also sent a congratulations note – something usually not done by popes until inauguration day – and he made no mention of or even allusion to abortion. Our bishops tend to be dumb. When they do something, they tend to be crude and miss nuance.
Which leads to Finn. I’ve known Bob 20+ years. I even hired him for the formation faculty at Kenrick Seminary in STL and made him a spiritual director. He was always right of center but not oddly so. What was most noticeable about him (at least to me) was that he was the most boring human being I have ever met. We worked together closely for the papal trip in ‘99 and on more than one occasion I wanted to shoot him – not because he was obnoxious but because he would just drone on and on and on. I thought it odd that Rigali had him made a bishop but it was in order for him to clean up KC-St Joe after a problematic Irish bishop. I was surprised when his true colors began to show after arriving in KC-St Joe especially learning that he was a very active member of Opus Dei and had been for decades. These days, when he’s not opining on abortion, he is vesting in his lace and trains for Tridentine Masses which he strongly supports. In fact, check out the following for Finn in his glory as he uses the old rite of church consecrations to dedicate a church in his diocese just for this purpose: http://www.institute-christ-king.org/gallery/album-61/67/ .
Father Joseph, are you suggesting that the Bishops should have remained silent about the gruesome act of abortion and the desire of many to redefine Marriage and the Family?
No, Nancy, he’s objecting to “apocalyptic warnings and threats.” There is a middle ground between irresponsible rhetoric and silence.
Mollie, I am interested in what Father Joseph has to say in regards to my question which was should the Bishops remain silent about the gruesome act of abortion and the desire of many to redefine Marriage and the Family.
Where’s a good place to get a breakdown on the Cathoic vote?
Nancy: No, I am not suggesting that. Why do you ask?
Because I am wondering what you think the Bishops should have said about the gruesome act of abortion and the desire of many to redefine Marriage and the Family.
Mr.Jaglowicz
If Jesus were running the vineyards, the wages would be just. There would be no need for a union.
Oonefrom Tobit asks for a good place to get a breakdown on the Catholic vote. Beliefnet.com has more detail than others:
http://blog.beliefnet.com/stevenwaldman/2008/11/exit-polls-the-faith-factor-20.html
Beliefnet says that McCain led among Catholics who attend Mass weekly, 52-47. Obama led among other Catholics, 58-40. In both cases, Obama-Biden substantially improved over the Dems’ ticket in 2004.
It would be nice to have a breakdown of how Hispanic Catholics voted, but I haven’t seen that. I think Hispanic Catholics were a key factor.
They should have said that abortion is a grave sin, and that marriage is between a man and a woman. Why do you ask?
Mollie, I am interested in what Father Joseph has to say in regards to my question which was should the Bishops remain silent about the gruesome act of abortion and the desire of many to redefine Marriage and the Family.
No, that’s not what you asked. “Father, what do you think the bishops should have done?” would have been a valid question. But here’s what you said: “Father Joseph, are you suggesting that the Bishops should have remained silent…” (etc.) You ignored his words and accused him of saying something else. Responding to what people actually say is a minimum requirement for good-faith participation in a discussion. Setting up straw men and goading people into defending their orthodoxy is tiresome and unproductive, and I’d like you to stop.
So, Commnweal considers Mr. B a catholic? That’s interesting. His actions and his beliefs indicate otherwise.
Mollie, the beginning of Wisdom is knowing what questions to ask. I happen to respect Father Joseph, and I simply wanted him to clarify his answer. I do not believe simply stating that abortion is a grave sin and that Marriage is between a Man and Woman has convinced the majority of Catholics,or quite frankly all who profess to be Catholic, of the profound impact ignoring those Truths has on Life here on Earth as well as our Hope for eternal Salvation.
Father Joseph, I asked the question because I wanted to know your view on how you think the Bishops should address these issues.
“It would be nice to have a breakdown of how Hispanic Catholics voted, ”
I read a Dick Polman piece – which unfortunately I can’t find now – that repeated the 53 / 46 split for Catholics as a whole, and added that Hispanics went to Obama by 66% / 33%.
Obviously the Cahtolic vote for Obama looks different – literally – than the Catholic vote for Kennedy in 1960. It’s good for me to remind myself of this from time to time.
Nancy, I respect Fr. Joseph too. But questions that begin “Are you suggesting…” and go on to fabricate an argument the addressee has not made are not respectful. Wisdom is a fine guiding principle; let’s apply it a little more rigorously.
Ann, so true. Thank you!
Ann: To judge from his parable, if Jesus were running the vineyard, everyone would get the same wage no matter how many hours they worked, and then there wouldn’t be anybody willing to work the whole day if those who worked only one hour got the same pay as those who worked all day. Nonne?
Nancy: Neither have dire threats of exclusion from the eucharist or even of eternal damnation “convinced the majority of Catholics,or quite frankly all who profess to be Catholic, of the profound impact ignoring those Truths has on Life here on Earth as well as our Hope for eternal Salvation.” So neither strategy has worked. What to do now? Any positive suggestions?
“Speaking of George, I thought it interesting that he sent the de rigeur congratulations note to Obama today on behalf of the USCCB and, of course, he got in a not too subtle reference to abortion. B-16, on the other hand, also sent a congratulations note – something usually not done by popes until inauguration day – and he made no mention of or even allusion to abortion. Our bishops tend to be dumb. When they do something, they tend to be crude and miss nuance.”
FWIW, here is the text of the letter sent to President-elect Obama by the US bishops:
Dear President-elect Obama,
I write to you, in my capacity as President of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops, to express our congratulations on your historic election as President of the United States. The people of our country have entrusted you with a great responsibility. As Catholic Bishops, we offer our prayers that God give you strength and wisdom to meet the coming challenges.
Our country is confronting many uncertainties. We pray that you will use the powers of your office to meet them with a special concern to defend the most vulnerable among us and heal the divisions in our country and our world. We stand ready to work with you in defense and support of the life and dignity of every human person.
May God bless you and Vice President-elect Biden as you prepare to assume your duties in service to our country and its citizens.
Sincerely yours,
Francis Cardinal George, OMI
Archbishop of Chicago
President
Jim – value your input and analysis. My point was that given the election cycle and the partisan tone of some bishops towards Obama, one can read into the words of George. I know he is your Cardinal but compare his words, tone, attitude to the statements by Wuerl or even B16. Wuerl’s statement is actually poetic – encompasses our struggle with racism and joins with Obama and the US on a new journey.
Why doesn’t George use scriptures (e.g. Exodus, some of the Judges, some of the psalms), why doesn’t he pull from the liturgy (e.g. certain prayers, remark how a county’s election day is very much like a sacramental moment), why doesn’t he pull from church images, use the words of a US saint who worked with African-Americans?
I am sorry; but the statement has no joy; does not unite; he narrowly talks about life and dignity of each person. He speaks in generalities with no eloquence – compare his words to Obama’s speach Tuesday nite. One is eloquent; the other meets the “polite” requirement of society.
This is the problem with much of what certain bishops said and did – they command; they condemn; they are arrogant; they do not listen; and they are NOT eloquent; and even more so, they fail to use the liturgical, sacramental, and scriptural history of our tradition.
Ann Olivier and Joseph Komonchak, I must wonder if Jesus would support labor organizing and attempts to negotiate a just wage. How would Jesus define “just wage?” Would Jesus even want to define “just wage?” Given the gospel passage, can we surmise that Jesus would align himself with management rather than with labor?
On the other hand (and from a different perspective), would Jesus be OK with each and every one of us showing up for one hour’s work at end of day and still getting a full day’s pay? (I have to put myself in this category much of the time :)
Would Jesus tell us not to worry, reminding us that even the birds in the air get what they need day in and day out? Would labor-management relations be a non-issue for him?
Thanks for posting the USCCB letter, Jim. I don’t think there’s anything “crude” about it — and the reference to abortion is no more prominent than it should be. Less, if anything; there’s no reason they should refrain from mentioning it. But it also acknowledges that there’s more to “defend[ing] the most vulnerable among us” and “protecting the life and dignity of every human person” than just working to outlaw abortion. How much more nuanced could they be? I think it’s an encouraging first step, and I hope they keep communicating in that spirit. (The individual members as well as the group.)
Father Joseph, I continue to Pray that all Catholics remain faithful to His Church. Someone who professes to be Catholic, but intentionally misrepresents the Catholic Faith, has excommunicated themself from the Church. They can continue to present themselves for Communion, but I assure you, God is no fool. He knows. I believe that any person, who professes to be Catholic but makes a public statement that is not consistent with our Faith should be publically corrected for the sake of His Church.
So, Molly, are you saying that I am not being respectful because I asked Father Joseph if he thought the Bishops should remain silent on the issue? It does not appear that the majority of Catholics respected what the Bishops had to say regarding the Sanctity of Life and the Sanctity of Marriage and the Family. I respect Father Joseph but I simply do not believe the Bishops have done enough regarding the Sanctity of Life and the Sanctity of Marriage and the Family. If they had done enough, then all Catholics would understand that these two issues are not open for debate. But then again, if all Catholics respected the teaching of the Church, there would be no division on these issues.
Nancy: Excommunication is a technical phrase in Catholic canon law. I do not know any canon in our Catholic lawbook that says that a person who intentionally misrepresents the Catholic Faith has excommunicated himself. Can you cite one? It would be a grave sin, yes, but not one of those crimes considered to be de facto excommunicating.
Secondly, there was and is no Church teaching that led by unquestionable logic to the conclusion that a Catholic may not vote for Obama. And the great majority of US bishops did not themselves draw this conclusion or urge it upon their people. They recognized that there were more issues at stake than the two you mention and that there could be genuine disagreements among good and faithful Catholics as to how your two issues might best be safeguarded. More general and fuller respect for the teaching of the Church would by no means guarantee that there would not be division on concrete measures, as for example, the choice among candidates or with regard to public policy.
To excommunicate oneself from the Church is to intentionally deny a Truth of our Catholic Faith.
“If you deny Me, you deny the one who sent Me.”-Christ
“You can not be my Disciples if you do not keep my Word.”-Christ.
“If you Love Me, you will keep my Commandments.”-Christ.
Information about the public violation of Canon 750, par.1 of the Code of Canon Law, can be found on the internet. There is also a wonderful article on Catholic’s United for Faith: No Man’s an Island that can be found on the internet as well. Today, almost everything that is in print, can be found on the internet which can be used as a valuable tool for finding information.
The desire to pass the Freedom of Choice Act and the desire to change the definition of Marriage could not possibly safeguard the Sanctity of Life and the Sanctity of Marriage and the Family. These acts would only serve to destroy the Sanctity of Life and the Sanctity of Marriage and the Family which would profoundly impact not only our Life here on Earth but our Hope for eternal Salvation as well. I will continue to Pray for the conversion of Hearts. Some of you have a lot of work to do regarding the conversion of Hearts. You know who you are. I wish you all Peace.
Nancy Danielson
Only 90 Bishops out of 270 made those statements regarding abortion. But you, who are so accepting of the hierarchy, are so sure that you know better than the 180 Bishops who chose to let ‘Faithfull Citizenship’ be the guide!
Nancy: You wrote: “To excommunicate oneself from the Church is to intentionally deny a Truth of our Catholic Faith.” You probably meant this the other way round: “Intentionally to deny a Truth of our Catholic Faith is to excommunicate oneself from the Church.” I would like to know where you find this in our canon law. You apoear to use the verb “escommunicate” very loosely; it is so severe a punishment that it is carefully circumscribed in church law, and this for reasons both of justice and of charity.
Sunil’s point is pertinent. The bishops, official teachers of the Church, were divided and known by their people to be divided.
I believe that any person, who professes to be Catholic but makes a public statement that is not consistent with our Faith should be publically corrected for the sake of His Church.
At last, Nancy, I agree wholeheartedly. Proclaiming that no Catholic could have voted for Obama without committing mortal sin is not consistent with Church teaching. I am eager to see those who make that statement corrected publicly.
I’ve explained pretty clearly what I find disrespectful: demanding that others defend arguments they have not made; repeating the same things over and over even after you’ve been answered. Not listening, in short. I would also say it’s less than respectful to insist that you know more about canon law than Fr. Komonchak. I do wish you were right that clarity and consistency from the bishops would heal division and prevent conflict within the Church, but I’m afraid that’s not how it works.
If one is not in communion with His Church, then one has excommunicated himself/herself from His Church. The Good News is, God, who is Love and Mercy, will welcome anyone who desires to be in communion with Him and expresses sorrow for their sins.
“Jim – value your input and analysis. My point was that given the election cycle and the partisan tone of some bishops towards Obama, one can read into the words of George. I know he is your Cardinal but compare his words, tone, attitude to the statements by Wuerl or even B16. Wuerl’s statement is actually poetic – encompasses our struggle with racism and joins with Obama and the US on a new journey.
“Why doesn’t George use scriptures (e.g. Exodus, some of the Judges, some of the psalms), why doesn’t he pull from the liturgy (e.g. certain prayers, remark how a county’s election day is very much like a sacramental moment), why doesn’t he pull from church images, use the words of a US saint who worked with African-Americans?”
Hi, Bill, I agree there is something formal, perhaps even pro-forma, about the congratulatory note. Perhaps some of it is just Cardinal George himself – he tends to come across as relatively “formal” in a lot of his public communications.
I don’t think the tone is chilly, but neither is it celebratory. It’s not intimate. It’s gracious but in a formal way.
Just my opinion.
“I am sorry; but the statement has no joy; does not unite; he narrowly talks about life and dignity of each person. He speaks in generalities with no eloquence – compare his words to Obama’s speach Tuesday nite. One is eloquent; the other meets the “polite” requirement of society.
“This is the problem with much of what certain bishops said and did – they command; they condemn; they are arrogant; they do not listen; and they are NOT eloquent; and even more so, they fail to use the liturgical, sacramental, and scriptural history of our tradition.”
FWIW – I was at a preaching workshop this past Friday, in which the presenter talked about his reaction to listening to Obama’s acceptance speech. He looked upon the tens of thousands of cheering faces and saw their hunger for a better place, a better world. He listened to the apt phrases and picture-perfect metaphors and said to himself, “Obama’s saying what *we* should be saying. He’s stealing *our* thunder!” And then he talked about what we could accomplish if we could preach like that.
Molly, I agree that it would be disrespectful if I had insisted that I know more than Father Komonchak regarding Canon Law. I would also be lying, since my Degree is in Education. That does not change the fact that I can assume that Canon Law is going to be consistent with the teachings of the Magisterium of the Church, which is consistent with Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture.